Secularizing Buddhism: interview with Matthew O’Connell on Imperfect Buddha

Here is the link to an interview conducted by Matthew O’Connell on his podcast, Imperfect Buddha: <https://imperfectbuddha.com/2021/08/10/82-ibp-richard-k-payne-on-securalizing-buddhism/>

This is the second interview, the first is <https://soundcloud.com/imperfect-buddha-podcast/48-ibp-richard-k-payne-critical-reflections-on-western-buddhism>, with a nice photo of me looking adventurous.